Xen and Mdadm?
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@biggen said:
I'm also confused on what I would need to download. Is Xenserver the proper download or is it just "Xen"?
You'll want XenServer. XS is a "distro" of Xen. Xen itself is ONLY the hypervisor. Think of it like the Linux kernel. XenServer is to CentOS as Xen is to Linux.
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@DustinB3403 said:
Xen is the fully open source product (if that makes sense) Xen Server is the "bundle" that you can buy support with.
This is confusing for several years.
XenServer (never Xen Server, that would imply something different) is fully open sources and made by the Xen team the same as Xen. XenServer can get third party support, but so can Xen. Xen without XenServer has support from Red Hat, Suse, Canonical and tons of smaller players. XenServer has Citrix support famously but also can have support from other players. But there is nothing in the XenServer ecosystem (except for the XC client on Windows) that isn't open source.
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@scottalanmiller you're really killing me over a space mark.....
XenServer Xen Server..... "You say tomato, I say tomato. " (say it in your head)
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@DustinB3403 said:
@scottalanmiller you're really killing me over a space mark.....
You can't change the spelling of product names.
XenServer - a specific product
Xen server - any server from any company built using Xen
They are extremely different things. Install Ubuntu with Xen and you get a Xen Server but clearly it is not XenServer.
When he's asking specifically about the differences between a Xen server and XenServer, just casually flipping the names back and forth is pretty confusing.
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All XenServers are Xen servers. But not all Xen servers are XenServer.
Tons of us were running Xen servers many years before XenServer even existed.
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@scottalanmiller OK that is a good way to explain it, XenServer is Citrix's product, everything else is Xen (on something or just Xen)
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@scottalanmiller said:
XenServer has Citrix support famously but also can have support from other players.
This I did not know. Like who?
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@FATeknollogee MSPs for example, or businesses like NTG.
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@FATeknollogee said:
@scottalanmiller said:
XenServer has Citrix support famously but also can have support from other players.
This I did not know. Like who?
Well we support it, for example. LOL.
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@DustinB3403 said:
@scottalanmiller OK that is a good way to explain it, XenServer is Citrix's product, everything else is Xen (on something or just Xen)
Yes. Although it isn't really Citrix' product, it's Linux' product. Citrix makes nothing. Citrix does own the XenServer brand, but they simply provide support, they do not make XenServer.
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@scottalanmiller does NTG support XenServer even if the client doesn't have support from Citrix?
Just curious at what point does NTG say "Call Citrix"
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Citrix makes a lot of things, but none around virtualization
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@DustinB3403 said:
@scottalanmiller does NTG support XenServer even if the client doesn't have support from Citrix?
You would almost never get support from NTG if you had support from Citrix. Not specific support, at least. It is really rare that we would ever say "call the vendor." That's not a normal thing. Especially when we are talking about a product that isn't made by Citrix and is open source. Normally "call the vendor" is what you need to do if there is a license problem. The idea that you call your vendor for support is actually weird and pretty uncommon outside of the SMB space and while I can only imagine it is kind of common there, even in the SMB space I've never seen it as a thing outside of the SW community. The idea that you would call any vendor for support (except for bugs in the product that obviously they had to fix) was completely new to me when I joined SW.
For example, at the big bank that I worked at, we had Red Hat support, but we escalated to them exactly zero times in my decade of experience there. I've never escalated a Windows problem to Microsoft ever. Going to the vendor for support should be pretty uncommon.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Well we support it, for example. LOL.
Does that mean I can build a "white box" XenServer & "contract" support from NTG?
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@scottalanmiller Why would a customer not choose to have a local support specialist that they could call (NTG) to assist if something arose, while avoiding calling the vendor at the same time.
That doesn't seem odd, maybe a bit more costly. But IIRC the support options from Citrix are a few tickets a year. Before additional surcharges are billed by Citrix.
Whereas if I as a client wanted support, but not to use one of those few support tickets from Citrix I would burn an hour with NTG instead.
(or am I just insane when I think like this?)
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@FATeknollogee said:
Does that mean I can build a "white box" XenServer & "contract" support from NTG?
Of course! We've been supporting Xen since before XenServer was even out
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@scottalanmiller said:
Of course! We've been supporting Xen since before XenServer was even out
Well ya got to spread the word
How is pricing structured?
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@DustinB3403 said:
@scottalanmiller Why would a customer not choose to have a local support specialist that they could call (NTG) to assist if something arose, while avoiding calling the vendor at the same time.
That doesn't seem odd, maybe a bit more costly. But IIRC the support options from Citrix are a few tickets a year. Before additional surcharges are billed by Citrix.
Whereas if I as a client wanted support, but not to use one of those few support tickets from Citrix I would burn an hour with NTG instead.
(or am I just insane when I think like this?)
I'm not 100% sure that I follow the question but maybe this will help...
Getting support from a Citrix type vendor means you are getting support "for the scope of their product." It's very technical, but very limited support. No one will likely be able to support XenServer itself as well as Citrix. However, who needs XenServer supported like that? Meaning... who needs to make the vendor modify the code itself? Almost no one. If you need OEM vendor support it means that the product itself was bad and so you have a Catch-22 of that support model.
Getting support from an NTG type vendor means you are getting support "for the scope that you want." Citrix won't get to know your business and won't support the end users or the storage platform or talk to you about whether XenServer is the right choice or support you if you move to another platform. NTG does holistic support of your company and IT needs, not just of one specific product because you realistically will never need support of just one application but at least of the use cases surrounding it and likely far more far reaching.
OEM vendor support is useful when you are talking about hardware warranties like HPE or Dell would provide. But when it comes to software, architecture and general IT you almost exclusively want general IT support. There is no real call for the other.
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@FATeknollogee said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Of course! We've been supporting Xen since before XenServer was even out
Well ya got to spread the word
How is pricing structured?
That's complex because NTG is not a one size fits all company. You can do the simplest thing and just buy blocks of hours to use. Then you can use them for whatever you want. Or you can get into an MSP model with set monthly pricing. Project pricing is available but we always recommend against that as it is a bad way to set up a vendor relationship.
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@scottalanmiller So to summarize what you've said,
If it's a software appliance that you need support on (and you aren't changing the code) get general IT support as it's often far better of a fit for support because the general IT support company understand what the business (customer) is trying / doing.
Correct?
